Spread ’Em Out, Pick Your Matchup: Is This The Giants New Identity?! | All-22 Film Breakdown

Ryan Reynolds here for Mint Mobile. I don't know if you knew this, but anyone can get the same premium wireless for $15 a month plan that I've been enjoying. It's not just for celebrities. So do like I did, and have one of your assistance assistants switch you to Mint Mobile today. I'm told it's super easy to do at mintmobile.com/switch. Upfront payment of $45 for three month plan equivalent to $15 per month required. Intro rate first three months only, then full price plan options available, taxes and fees extra, default terms at mintmobile.com. At High Five Casino, the Prestige Loyalty Program rewards your play with real benefits. Reach icon status to get two extra sweeps coins on 180 game coins daily, just for logging in. Level up and unlock up to 50 sweeps coin bonus plus growing daily rewards. It's dynamic, it's exclusive, it's prestige and it's only at High Five Casino. Your next High Five moment awaits. No purchase necessary, void work prohibited by law must be 21 years or older terms and conditions apply. High Five Casino. Hey, what do you say, ladies and gentlemen? Dan and I are excited to introduce our Buy Me a Coffee page. We've had a lot of listeners reach out and say, hey there, Bob, we really appreciate what you do and want to support the show. Well, here's one way to do that without big corporations taking, I don't know, 30% of the cut of your generosity. Just head over to www.buymeacoffee.com/bigbluebanter and chip in if you'd like to support us directly. Every contribution means a lot and it helps keep the show going strong. We appreciate each and every one of you. Thanks for listening and have a lovely day. Welcome back. It's the Big Blue Banter New York Giants Football Podcast. I'm Dan Schneier. Joining is always my co-host Nick Falato. Second time I got the intro wrong in the last two dates because I'm probably excited. And who would be excited about a tie? Well, I am because when I went back and watched the tape, I came away overwhelmingly positive what the Giants put on film. And there were about five, six, seven moments in that game, Nick, where they should have won the game, dude. Even thinking back to like the inches away that neighbors and Jamis were before the half of connecting on that long 50-yard touchdown that would have changed the game or the drop screen from neighbors in overtime or even the Mooney drop in overtime that would have made it a 40-yard attempt for Zavada rather than a 46-yard attempt, or maybe it would have been like 38-yard attempt for Zavada. All these little moments, I felt like the Giants show resiliency on tape. I think they played better than the commanders on tape. They just gave up a few big plays on defense, mostly Jane and Daniel's runs, which we'll get into on the next podcast. But as I look back at where this offense is headed, where this team is headed from an identity standpoint, the fight they showed, the resiliency, the things they were able to accomplish in the passing game, which as I watch a lot of teams around the NFL every week for Beyond the Boxscore, I don't see even a third or a half of the teams accomplishing the things that the Giants were able to accomplish in the passing game. Far hash throws, intermediate in breakers, rips over the middle, anticipatory throws for touchdowns. That was a one-game sample size. I mean, over the last two games, Nick, James Winston is number one in the NFL and EPA among all quarterbacks, not among backup quarterbacks who are starting, among all quarterbacks. He's number one in the NFL and EPA. That's the giant. That's a stat about the Giants offense as much as it is about James. So that's where I wanted to start today. Yeah, it's not happening in neutral game scripts either. It's happening when the defense knows the Giants are going to throw the football and the Giants are throwing the football. And guess what? They're having a lot of success. And I love that you brought up the far hash throws. How many far hash attempts did he have in this game? He is not allowing Dan Quinn or opposing defensive coordinators. And he does not allow them to get cute with their leverages and try to use the field to their advantage, right? Like we've seen previous Giants quarterbacks, like Daniel Jones, for instance, go up against these Dan Quinn coached defenses. And you would have the field side wide receiver who is in a plus splits, meaning outside the numbers, you would have the cornerback facing that wide receiver playing inside leverage, forcing the quarterback to put the perfect throw over the top. James Winston was targeting those. Sometimes it was not successful. The one play where he threw to Malik Neighbors was like this. It was an inside leverage receiver, and he put it up to Malik Neighbors, and it got popped in the air, and it went incomplete. But guess what, man? The defensive coordinator now knows, I can't really get cute with my leverage and try to gain a spatial advantage against James Winston, because if that leverage isn't tight, James will try to fit it in there. And a guy like Malik Neighbors is going to Moss, the Mike Sanrestills and the Amique Robertsons and the Rasul Douglases of the world. And I just love that mentality from your quarterback. And not just the mentality, but the arm. Look, the guy has arm strength, the guy has velocity, the guy can make all the NFL throws. I know it's been a little bit inconsistent throughout his time here with the Giants in this season, but we've seen it, dude. That thing jumps out of his hands sometimes. Like I came away very impressed with what we saw from James Winston, how James Winston was checking at the line and getting the Giants into the right looks, how the Giants were scheming plays against the defense that knew they were going to be passing the football. Overall, this 93 plays, this was 93 plays, three touchdown drives in the late in the third quarter and into the fourth quarter. It was a phenomenal performance in the second half by the Giants, and James Winston balled out of his mind, he played much better than I could have realized. I just, throughout my notes, I just have so many, holy shit, James, you know what I mean? There's a lot of that written all throughout my notes here. Even as far as just recognizing man coverage before the snap, post-snap, confirming it, seeing where the blitzers are coming from, and then taking that scramble 15 yards in overtime on like third and 10 or second time, even those plays that he made in this game to extend this football game. And I love that you brought up Dan Quinn, because we've played this Dan Quinn defense countless times throughout our life, following and covering this podcast. We've got on here on all 22 film reviews and said, nobody's pulling the trigger, and Dan Quinn is just toying with our offense, toying with us. And again, I'm sorry, and I did tell you guys last podcast, I won't bring it up, but I'm not sorry because sometimes you need to reference the past to talk about the future like Nick just did. And I'm going to reference it again by saying, Dan Quinn used to leave the field side basically wide open during the Daniel Jones years, because he knew that he could get a schematic advantage from a spatial standpoint by just leaving it open because Jones would not target that area of the field. He may be, whatever, I'm not going to get into the why, but he wouldn't do it. And so it gave them an advantage every fucking time they played us. And we barely did anything against his defenses. That was not the case in the second half of this game. He could not afford to do that because James Winston will throw the field side throws and he'll make a lot of them too. The throw he made in overtime, Nick, which we'll go over later because I saw in your notes and it's obviously in my notes, the best throw on film. The throw he made in overtime on the in breaking Malik neighbors that he put over two defenders in the second level that he anticipated and threw into space, not where Malik neighbors was when he released the football, he threw it to where he would be and then with the velocity to get it there so the safety doesn't break on it and we'll go over it later and the trajectory to get it there. That's one of the best throws a Giants quarterback has made clearly all season and over the last decade of Giants football would probably be from a difficulty level in the top five or ten. You could say what you want about Jameis. He was bad in the first half. Some of that shit was just like bad execution by the Giants offense too and no run game because you mentioned it. All this was done and it's impressive that it was done in comeback mode when the defense could just tee off and play the pass. All this was also done, Nick, in a game script where the Giants average 2.8 yards per carry. Yeah. We'll get into some of the reasons why that was happening. But dude, I appreciated the game plan at least from the Giants when they were passing the flip. I wish they got into spread because it's obvious and you nailed it on yesterday's show. Once the Giants went into a hurry up spread, maybe a little bit lighter personnel, 11 and 12 personnel with Theo Johnson acting as a wide receiver, they were successful, dude. And it wasn't like they were reinventing the wheel through passing. It was decisive decision making pre to post snap by James Winston. And then your playmakers simply making plays and bailing James Winston out when James Winston wasn't perfect like Theo Johnson, a guy that we never praise on this podcast because Theo Johnson, we always talk about his potential, all the potential deal just like late. It's like freaking waiting for Godot. It's like, when the hell is it going to happen? Right. But it happened here on that one play to the back shoulder. He catches it. That's that's an excellent play by Theo. But then as Theo, you know, give it to you, take it away. And that was almost an interception because Theo Johnson's route a little bit later on in the game. But I digress off that point. The point is, the Giants had a clear plan here to attack outside the numbers. Like they knew that Dan Quinn was going to be in a lot of this cover three type shit. So they were just trying to clear out cover three, clear out the deep vertical, the deep third vertical, and then hit like a seven on the backside and then maybe hold that curl flat defender with someone. Sale type of concepts, things like that. A lot of in breaking stems that bent outwards against man and the tight zone coverage that Dan Quinn likes to run a lot. And I felt like the Giants passing the football, whether it was under center or spread, they were having a lot of success because the Jimmy's on the Giants are a lot better than the Joe's on Washington. So just take advantage of your matchups. No one was covering Isaiah, likely. Nobody was covering, no one was covering the league neighbors. Well, they weren't able to, meaning like, I know what you mean by that. Not like, it's not like the defense wasn't trying to cover them. They were. What you're saying here, Nick, is what I was trying to say last night. And I stand by after watching the tape. They're not able to cover these guys. Some of these matchups are going to go into week by week. Most of them on the neighbors front. And I think, honestly, most of them, if he's healthy, on the likely front, where teams just simply don't have an answer to cover these guys. The way they deploy likely makes it really difficult to make it to match up with him. And we saw that on Keith. Their downs from the Giants. We saw that obviously in the second half more. I'm talking about Keith for sounds of the first half. And then from a neighbor's standpoint, when healthy, which it looks like he pretty much is, he's one of the five most difficult covers in the NFL. I watched this guy get in and on his breaks. There was even a play late in the game, I think, in overtime or one of those drives at the end or the last few scoring drives. It was over time where neighbors ran this really long developing route where he's basically running the vertical stem and then just has a really good break at the top of it to create like inside separation. Jamis is just waiting for him and then throws the football on that in cut and like he trusts it now Jamis. And that's what neighbor is trying to say. I think last week to the coaches and to Jamis, I'm sure a bunch, just trust me, man, I will make the play. You just gotta trust me. I will win my route. I will make the play. And that's what Jamis is doing. He spreads it out and he's picking these matchups, whether it be likely or neighbors and occasionally fields, that will grow. He's essentially putting the trust in those players and his own arm to get the ball there on those far hash throws. And that's where it leads me to believe, like to question, to pose this question, Nick, that I posed in the title of this video. Is this a new Giants identity or should this be the new Giants identity for moving forward? Should we be a team that spreads them out and picks the matchup? And should that be our first really go to on offense? And they're not gonna, look, no team's gonna run exclusively out of shotgun. No team's definitely gonna run tempo all game. That's ridiculous to even ask for. And I'm not asking for that either. But should this be what our identity is on offense? Because right now it feels like we're a team, to me Nick, that has an identity we wanna be, which is a smash mouth, run first football team, that doesn't fit with the personnel we have, and then has another identity that we found simply by trailing against the Cardinals early, and by trailing against the commanders in the fourth quarter, that we've had to go to, to spread them out and attack the matchups. And it just feels like that one works a lot better for us. Yeah, it does seem that way, man. And it's like the Giants know how to attack these defenses, right? We've seen that from this coaching staff. And I mean, they're coaches in the NFL, they should be able to dial that up, right? But their identity, they're not having success with the identity they wanna have success with. Like James Winston, his under center throws, I think he was three of seven in this game for 36 yards, suffering a sack. One of them was the 20 yard catch to Malik neighbors, it was a five yard dump off to Najee Harris and an 11 yard play to Isaiah Likely. That was to, I believe, start the second half. But the Giants ran a lot of these longer developing routes from under center and they had like the max protection. And I don't hate a lot of those, right? Like I like what they're thinking, but you need to be able to protect. And the Giants are being able to protect, which doesn't seem as natural for James Winston. He's in shock and he could see everything pre to post snap. He doesn't have to turn his back to do the play action and then reset himself. I don't think that's the strength of James Winston's game to operate that type of offense. But like there was just a lot of stretch, stretch the deep vertical attack underneath, hold that deep vertical defender, hit the player behind. There was a lot of just two man route concepts where the Giants knew what they were doing with the football pre to post snap. And James did a good job processing that when it was a shotgun, right? But when it's not, it's not that he does a bad job. I just don't think that's the best use of his talents and the Giants need to seriously consider switching up their overall identity to maybe having a little bit more spread concepts and relying on Isaiah likely and the league neighbors and diagnosing things pre to post snap from a view that is more advantageous for a quarterback like James Winston, which would be from shotgun. And that's right. And you even mentioned it on yesterday's show, Nick. You said even last week when they had the heavier personnel and they spread them out in the red zone and got one of the best plays out of that from spread again. I think you're right. I think the way James operates as a quarterback, he's much better out of the shotgun with everything spread out where he can see things and diagnose it much better than when he has to turn around and hit it off. Because you're right. In the beginning of the game, before they get into this mode and comeback mode, they had some concepts dialed up from under center, these deep play action drops, where it's just it looks a little clunky to me with James. I don't think he's the best athlete, right? I think we can all agree on that. And I don't think he's kind of like the best lateral mover, even like he has some verticality, I guess, like he had that scramble was like, it was slow, but it was like it was okay. But as far as Jeter throw to that one made me laugh. Which one? He jumps up and threw across his body. Oh, the lateral one. Are you talking about? Oh, no. I know where you're almost at. They actually had open guys on that play, but there were quite. And this is another thing. And we'll get into this in a little bit because I'm not chastising James Winston per se, but when the commanders ran like zero looks or even one looks, Malachi Fields was open. He was open more than a few times. I had three times. One would have been, I think he would have been open, but James was quick. He got rid of it likely like very fast, but he just won off of his release. It's just one of those things that I think we should keep in mind that I think will be discussed in the meeting rooms with the, it's like, yo, Fields is winning these one on one matchups pretty consistently. Maybe, you know, look that way when you get this look pre to post snap confirmed, because it seems like and it makes total sense for James Winston to do this. When he does confirm the look pre to post, and if it is like a zero look where there's no safety and you have one on one matchups, he looks for nine and he looks for one. He's not and that makes complete sense. But there were three opportunities this game where I was like, if he did look the other way, Malachi Fields has stacked and is vertical on his cornerback with no safety help over top. So I just wanted to give him his flowers for that. I think that's an excellent point, Nick, because what probably happens, or at least happened in this game, was that's just not where the first read was. But like you said, if you go back and watch the tape, the Giants coaches and Jamis may be in lockstep and thinking, well, that wasn't my first read those three times, but the next time I get this look from a defense, that could be my first read because we can expect this defense post snap with what's left on the back end, which the players, they don't actually rush, to be focused on shifting and rotating toward neighbors and likely, which is going to leave us one on one with fields. And I saw three times on tape, where his release off the line of scrimmage would have got me a win. So I would not be surprised if we see a big vertical win from fields and Jamis in this next game. I know it's an excellent point by you. And by the way, somebody mentioned this yesterday. Even though I don't want this to be the case, I do kind of weirdly wish it wasn't in New Orleans, just so I could see Jamis in a dome, dude, because I feel like this offense in a dome could look really fun right now, if neighbors and likely are healthy, especially with how beat up the Saints defenses in a dome, that's where Jamis is at his best. I think the weather does impact the quarterback like him. He's not the most elite arm talent in the world. I think he sees it better in the dome, judging off last year in his career, but that's neither here nor there. I think it's a great point by you about what fields could be moving forward based on what we saw. But yeah, man, I just felt like this game was a good example of what the Giants could be offensively and what they expect to be offensively, and what they could be to me. Do you want to say something off of that? Yeah, just another reason why I brought the fields point is it coincides with the overall point of should we spread it out? It's an identity point too, because it's not just fields as this big blocking receiver who fits the 21, 22 personnel package we want to block. No, it's also like you have a young competent receiver that we haven't realized how good he is yet and he's already uncovering. So if you do want to use 11, even 12 personnel and get fields out there and spread them out, I think he's competent enough to handle that extra responsibility and more than just three targets a game. I'm not saying the Giants should give him more than three targets a game because likely in neighbors are your one and your two. But I do believe the Giants have somebody in Malachi fields who can carry, carry a specific load that the Giants need if it's not working out, pause for for the other two. Just laughing at our comments. The chat's going crazy right now. So, I mean, I'm just going to keep dropping some. Spreading a mountain loads talk is always going to get the chat going. And I do appreciate the chat. Thank you. Please hit the like button if you haven't already. Support the show by hitting like constantly. The minute you watch a video, you should be thinking, I gotta hit like because I'm going to help these two grow their channel and they're going to keep delivering content as long as I help them grow the channel. That means you also have to like and comment both before, during and after shows. Subscribe, hype it, all of those good things. With that said, Nick, as I look at it moving forward, sure, personnel dictates match up. Sure, there's going to be different matchups and different personnel the Giants face throughout this Jameis tenure as starting quarterback. But the reality is, as I go into every single game moving forward, Nick, I don't really care who the defense is. My thought process is Jameis is a much better quarterback in spread. Neighbors are likely our two best options by far. There are best options when we are spread out and we give them more space to work with. And really, no matter the matchup, unless it's Dallas defense every week, I don't really feel great. And even that was with Dart at quarterback. I don't even really feel great about us going heavy and trying to run with Scadaboo and Aji and Tracy and Singletary and Runyon and the O-line. And it just doesn't feel like a smart play to me. What feels like a smart and then, yeah, it's cool. You want to hit your big shot off play action. But then what if Jameis, like you said, is a little bit slow to flip his head around and it's too late. It's like, get him comfortable, but more importantly, focus the offense around neighbors and likely. That's what moves the football. That's what gets explosive plays. And that's what has us scoring 63 points in the last two games and six offensive touchdowns. I mean, we were not too far removed, Nick, from the 2020 and 2021 season, where we averaged 24 total offensive touchdowns over two season course. We just scored a fourth of that in a two game sample size. Yeah. So I want that to continue. You're right. And look, dude, attention on neighbors. Dan Quinn was paying attention to Malik now. How many times when they were in the zone, the adjacent zones that neighbors were in, it was like alert, right? Their attention shifted towards Malik neighbors. That's another reason why, to be fair to the overall point I made before, some of the times Malik I. Fields was gaining an advantage was because he was in the one on one. And then another like the deep third was was looking at the short curl, right? What that the curl flat defender should have. But he was also paying attention to Malik neighbors. That's how much Malik neighbors is a threat. And that's how much Dan Quinn and Washington was paying attention to him. And he still went off for what he ended up going off for, which is a testament to how good he is. Yeah, but the Giants, they had a lot. They had success at throwing out of 12 personnel, right? They had, I think, a plus EPA, plus 740. That counts likely as a title. Yeah, yeah, exactly. But like you're still like you can get somewhat creative. And also some defense coordinators are going to match that differently. Some might match that with base. Some might match that with nickel, you know? And the Giants had a 66% success rate at a 12 personnel. They haven't used 12 personnel as much as they used 21 personnel. I don't believe I could pull that up when I'm done, when I shut the hell up, and 13 personnel. But they use it a decent amount in this game when they had to go to spread. And I saw formations when the Giants weren't empty that were a little bit different than what we've been seeing. And that's using empty formations. And on the three receiver side, Isaiah Likely and Theo Johnson were right next to each other, split off the line of scrimmage and everything like they were two wide receivers. They have two tight ends on that. That's a strength if you want to motion the running back back in and run towards that. It just gives the quarterback options at the line of scrimmage. And you have two big guys who are athletic enough to be receiving threats and mismatch type of players, specifically more Isaiah Likely than Theo Johnson. But maybe we see a little bit of an uptick in 12 personnel empty shotgun type of looks. And I begs the question, Dan, are we seeing that because it gives, I mean, it's probably a little calm, a little calm, but are we seeing that because the Giants want to use more 12 personnel and they can rely on the tight ends and it gives them the flexibility that we've been talking about where you can run the football, motion the back, back in, or is it because they just don't really have a consistent or they can't really rely on their 11 personnel package as much as they would like to? Right. Right. Because you really only have three receivers on this team and two of them barely get targets in Malachi fields and down on Mooney. That's a good point. That's interesting. As we move forward, how that will dictate what personnel will run out there, Nick? But we're 20 minutes in. I still want to hit on a bunch of stuff, including the overall offensive game plan and then the adjustments and the play calls from MattNagy. I thought he had multiple great play calls in this game. I thought he had a good game after watching the tape, the offensive line, if there's any hope for this run game moving forward. But I do want to get to the tape first and then we'll come back to all of that stuff because we are 20 minutes and I know a lot of people want to watch the tape and watch the film. It is, after all, titled in all 22 film breakdown. So let's get into some of the plays and we'll work from there. If your business runs on five different apps, 12 browser tabs and one spreadsheet that everyone's afraid to touch, it's probably time for Odoo. Odoo is an all-in-one business management software that connects every part of your business into one powerful, easy-to-use platform. So instead of wasting time switching between disconnected systems, your entire business works together in real time. Your team moves faster, your data stays accurate, and you can actually focus on growing your business. Let one unified system run your entire business. From the first opportunity to the final payment, everything works together in one place. Whether you're a small business or managing a large operation, Odoo gives you one flexible platform built to grow with you. Learn more at odoo.com. That's odoo.com. Your next High Five moment awaits. No purchase necessary void where prohibited by law must be 21 years or older terms and conditions apply. High Five Casino. Football is heating up and if you're looking for a fun way to make every game more exciting, PrizePix has you covered. PrizePix puts your favorite players and their projections all in one place, so you can build your lineup and select more or less on the stats you're watching. I've been keeping a close eye on the Giants this season and with the team sitting at 3-1, there are plenty of players worth watching every week. Whether you're following football, basketball or baseball, you can find your favorite players right in the PrizePix app. And the app makes it easy to stay locked in with improved search and live box scores, so you can follow your lineups without leaving the app. You can even check out popular projections from other users. Download the app today and use code BigBlue to get $150 instantly in lineups if you win your first $5 lineup. Download the app today, that's PrizePix, and use code BIGBLUE to get 150 instantly in lineups if you win your first $5 lineup. PrizePix, run your game. Your next High Five moment awaits. No purchase necessary. Work prohibited by law must be 21 years or older. Terms and conditions apply. High Five Casino. Yeah, let's do it. All right. Love getting into the plays here. So the first play that we have, this is the conversion to Isaiah Likely. Let me get our stupid faces off here. Yeah, there we go. Now we can see the whole screen. All right. So this was the third and 13th conversion on Deep Seven. Yep. Another far has this kind of like what I'm talking about. We saw a lot of route concepts that are similar to this. You have a condensed split here and you're going to have some sort of clear out with Malik neighbors and then a seven from Isaiah Lightly. But that cut at the top of the break right there. Such a good route, I like it. It's such a good route, dude. And you also have Mooney down here just holding this Defender 24. But watch how he... I don't want to use too much of this, but you're going to have inside bend and then out. And then you're going to have this where he inside bends towards neighbors. And that really gets 29 to go this way. And once that happens, that's when you could see right at this moment, 29 has to be like, Oh, am I going to flow over the top? What am I doing? Am I getting picked? Am I getting picked? What the hell is going on here? How do I react to this? And that's just such a good, like, not a lot of tight ends can sink their hips like that and then explode out and create that type of separation. And great job by by James Winston to deliver this football from the far hash before 24 can break on it and right in this little small window that he has, he doesn't throw him into like the five. He puts it right there just allowing Isaiah likely to just catch it and then get down. That's a great point, Nick. It's a great point about the ball placement and throwing it away from the coverage. I also love at the top of the screen, again, it's 12 personnel, right? Looking like an 11 person. Look at Theo Johnson with his double move. Ready? And he actually creates separations, swings over the top. Like, when the hell do we ever see Theo Johnson, like nail her out like this? And you would see a lot of this pre to post snap from the commander safety throughout the game when they went to these like single high type looks where the safety would start on the right hash and kind of like shade toward the left hash, daring the quarterback to throw out there I saw neighbors occasionally get these releases like Theo had and a few times put his hand up. I was curious like, if that ever tempted, it looked like Jamis was just completely either unaware or unbothered by it, but he never really pulled that trigger. There were a few times where I'm like, he could probably throw this between for neighbors and on this one, obviously Theo, but it ends up being the good result most of the time when he didn't, when he went the other way with it and threw the far hash. Yeah, he knew he had the one on one. So really like, look, you have the one on one because Malik is going deep and that's going to take this safety out of the play. So he basically likely just needs to beat 29, and 24 needs to sit on Darnell Mooney. So he's just reading those two, seeing what's happening and he trusted his arm strength. And then on this side, you'll see a great job by Brian Hudson picking up Frankie Loubout and then Tyrone Tracy Jr. in pass protection. Takes on Sonny Styles, just washes them out of the play, just a good job overall, good pocket. So a lot of outbreakers like that. Here's a second in 19. I just thought the way they robbed the middle of the field here was like an adjustment off of what the Giants have been doing all season. Just how you have that inverted cover two look where you're going to have dropped the cover two, dropped the cover two, and then he's going to sink down. And then sinking down, he's looking to remove this as a threat. Any kind of in-break and mostly it's going to be Isaiah Likely. So watch out. He just sits and he just drives on Isaiah Likely. And James doesn't really have anywhere to go with the football. There's really nowhere to go with the football. It was just curls basically across the board from the Giants just trying to work their quick game. And the middle of the field got robbed. James just doing James Winston things. And it's baseball thrown at Arnell Mooney. That just goes incomplete. But three by one, 11 personnel shotgun earlier in the game. This is still the first quarter. Winston, man, that's that's a James Winston type of play right there, if I've ever seen one. Yeah. Here's a second and seven play action shot. It ends up almost being completed, but it's a great play by the middle of the field, but it's another one of those under center plays where you have Najeeh Harrison there and you're trying to hit another deep shot doing what, Dan? Far hash attacking outside the numbers, two routes that are bending outside the numbers. I like this too because you already had the attention on Malik Nevers at this point. So you have these two defenders who are going to basically sit with Malik Nevers, which is exactly what happens. So what that's going to do for the Giants and Darnell Mooney is going to isolate him against this player. So this player, 39, needs to make a freaking phenomenal play to break on the football here, and he does that and he just gets there to knock this ball away. Or knock this ball away, but that's it. I like the design. If you're going to throw under center, attack outside the numbers, you're getting these middle of the field closed looks, make that safety cover grass and make them pay for leaving guys one-on-one out leverage to the outside. So the Giants identified that it wasn't a success, but I do appreciate that they identified it and they tried to attack it. Yeah, that's a great point, Nick. And they were willing to attack it on second and seven too. I think if Jameis is able to fully fall through on this throw and doesn't get hit, it's actually a completed throw and he's able to drive the football. I think that kind of took a little bit of the juice off the throw. Just not being able to fully step into it. Talk about a boss, just a boss play by Javon Kinlaw too and Sonny Stiles. And I felt like that was just, yeah. It's like Runyon. Yeah, no, it's Hudson and Runyon. Yeah, just getting tossed around. Yeah, Hudson and Runyon, yep. Yeah. Also, I just think it was a good play by Stiles to press up towards the line of scrimmage because you had the play action, you pressed up to the line of scrimmage, you're just going to hit one of them and then just allow it. He looked good, by the way, 50-20. Yeah, yeah, Stiles is a good player, bro. I mean, we knew it coming out. He had some weird reviews in training camp and I think he's totally quelled those. Yeah, yeah, he definitely did have some weird reviews, right? Here's a third and 10. Again, this is after, I think, a false start and the Giants just take a sack, just attack the B gap, right? There was nothing open, too, and I went back and watched this one on sideline, there was just no option here, the commanders just had a great play call. Yeah, exactly, and that's one of those follow blitzes where they're just attacking the B gap. Obviously, Andrew Thomson is taking 92, Runyon is going to take Kinlaw, so now Tyrone Tracy Jr. gets schemed 2 v 1, he's going to eliminate the most dangerous man and then it's going to be on Jamis to try to evade a safety blitzing. Just a great play call by Washington and the Giants had to punt. Here's a first and 10, third quarter. It's just, I put this one in here because, yeah, under center, another under center play action, so I wanted to kind of highlight that you had deep horizontal crosses with Isaiah Likely and Malik Neighbors. Cover three, middle of the field, close safety, dropped on neighbors. And I just put that because you look at Malachi Fields, right? Like some of the plays that we're talking about, Malachi Fields is streaking open on this play. And again, it's because of attention on Malik Neighbors because you get this cover three look where Malachi Fields is going to eat into the leverage of number two. He's going to outside stem that bitch. And then he's going to explode back towards there where that safety is, but that safety has his eyes purely on Malik Neighbors at that point. And you have the double horizontal cross from neighbors and Isaiah Likely. And Malachi Fields is just burnt number two. So that attention is something that if other teams keep doing it, the Giants need to attack it by using their other receivers, whether that be Fields or Mooney. This goes incomplete to Isaiah Likely though. And these are all kind of more longer developing route combination. You can see it like a double deep cross. It just felt like it wasn't suited for what the Giants do well right now. So I was happy to see, like as the game went on, they kind of went away from from trying, obviously, they had to down 14 points in the fourth quarter. But to me, it just feels like you're seeking, you're hunting a big play when there are just more freebies available to you when you actually spread them out and find the matchups for those two. Absolutely, man. Here's a fourth and four, just a great play call by Nagy. Yeah, everything's condensed, see? Everything's condensed within the numbers, right? 12 personnel, you're going to take the snap out of shotgun and you're going to release Tyrone Tracy Jr. Like he's going to be in pass protection, but you're just going to release him right through the line of scrimmage and get him to the flat. Oh yeah, Peter acting up. Man coverage, you have Theo Johnson as well. So this is just well executed. They figured they were going to get man coverage. They got man coverage and the Giants was a good prediction. Quick five man protection, just get rid of the football. And it's good to see Tracy back in the mix here on these third downs and these leverage, high leverage moments. I just feel like his role will actually continue to grow. Yeah, I agree. Here in the league, neighbors get some separate some I mean, he probably can't throw that football because this corner is sinking if James Winston isn't already rearing up. There's the interception to Amique Robertson. Again, another five man protection is empty formation Giants have been going empty in the red zone quite a bit. Yeah, likely at the O'Johnson next to each other, like we mentioned a little bit earlier. And look, this isn't a lot of contact, but it is contact. I would have been fine with it being a no call, but it changed this podcast dramatically, but it was called and that happens in the NFL. I see like Washington fans be like, oh, this is a conspiracy theory. It's like, that's absolutely silly. Like there is contact. It's just kind of all the time. It's just kind of weak contact, but it's still contact. And this is just a freaking, this is an elite throw by James Winston. I don't even think I realize how incredible it was. It's pretty insane. There's no window. Yeah, this is the touchdown to Likely. He's really good at, in my opinion, Nick, and you showed it earlier on that Likely 3rd and 13th conversion at like throwing low and away from coverage. I've seen them make a lot of these good low and away throws. Big low and away guy right here. But this is also like credit to Negi, right? You're going to fast motion, you're going to fast motion Darnold Mooney into the flat, and then you're going to take fields and you're going to use this. That's just going to expand the defense horizontally. And you just have Isaiah Likely just sit right behind all that. And he's already has leverage to the outside because it's Sonny Styles who's assuming him in coverage. With Mooney being that late addition, all three of those Washington defenders, as you see on the screen, assume fields and Mooney, and they have a plus one advantage there. But now you have Isaiah Likely with outside leverage against Sonny Styles, and James quickly sees it. Isaiah Likely is able to flip his hips around and then adjust to the low throw, low as it should be because you got to get it away from coverage, but the low throw, that's a great job by him. Dude, there's just not like, again, man, I don't want to like, you know. He's really good, dude. He really is, dude. Again, like when you're talking about traits out of a specific position, like Isaiah Likely has certain traits that not a lot of tight ends have. Or really receivers, to be honest. Yeah, like again, because he is a tight end, and he has the fluidity of some bigger receivers, dude. So he is a unique player who was stuck in a situation that definitely did not maximize his talents in Baltimore because of Mark Andrews, who, holy shit, I don't know if you watched the game last night, but every time I looked up, every time I looked up, I'm like Mark Andrews is making a mistake. He's so old and bad, and he had a bad training game. But it is kind of crazy to me, dude, with the Likely thing. I expect it to be a good signing and interesting and fun, but I never expect it to be this good. It's almost amazing to me how good he's been, and for half the price of the Wondell Robinson contract, and for a third of the price of the Alec Pierce contract. Yeah, it's silly. It was a massive win for the Giants. It really was. One of our best in a long time. Yes. It was zigging while the rest of the league is zagging. Oh, that's an inflated wide receiver market. We brought this up before. Let me sign a tight end who can play receiver, and fits more of what we want to do offensively anyways, and it was an absolute one. By the way, and I'm glad we got to this, because it really should be him getting all the flowers he can get, because he's made every single play he could possibly make for the Giants, including ones he shouldn't have made. But he's also blocking well too. You watch the tape and you're like, he's not a net liability blocking, in my opinion, likely. It's not anything like what it was like. Remember those early years of Evan Ingram, when he was first drafted by the Giants? It's not like watching that at all to me. No, no, it's not. Here's a second and five. I like the bunch formation. We saw more bunch in the three by one and not just spread out. More bunch in the three by one. Got a little post seam action here with Theo Johnson, 12 personnel, attacked the cover three zone, throw with anticipation. And that's an anticipatory throw right here. Watch James Winston rears back, knowing again, you have Malik neighbors, Malik neighbors talented. So you're going to have a sit, you're going to have a sit, and you're going to have a boop right there for Theo Johnson. That's exactly what happens. James delivers the football, Theo Johnson secures it, first down Giants. This is simple football type stuff, but I just really appreciate it, right? Right. Yeah, that's right. It seems simple, Nick, and I think that's where the misconception really lies with James Winston. A lot of the things he's doing seems simple, but they really shouldn't seem simple when we watched, you know, 2017 through 2023 Giants offense, because none of this was simple. Like that throw to Theo was well timed. The anticipation was good. He set his feet, he squared his hips, he drove the football to Theo on time, led Theo to a spot, and it was what, a 16, 18-yard gain, the one you went over before this. And that shit just wasn't happening for six, seven years of watching Giants offense. We weren't able to do any of that shit. I just feel like then the Giants had a lot of, and like this isn't the best representation of it, because this play right here, the fourth and eight, I don't know what Washington, like, yeah, you have a cover zero look, I got it, but Washington, you're giving like 12 yards of separation in your lineup against my league neighbors and Isaiah likely. It's just, you know, I just fundamentally think that's a bad way to play football. Probably. Yeah, like, look, you're going to have my league neighbors be your clear out as the number three, and that's going to draw a lot of attention, as we've already seen, and you're just bringing Isaiah likely right underneath it. There's been a lot of pick routes like that, that would work against man and then whatever other routes that would work against zone coverage within the Giants offense, which isn't, you know, every office, but I just feel like the Giants have been calling it well. And it's like, oh, well, that's a man beater or that's a zone beater. And then it works out for them. And that's something that I'm, again, another like hot tip to MattNagy and the Giants coaches. But here, I'm not necessarily pointing to that because this is a cover zero look. And it's just so much damn space, bro. Like, it's so much damn space. And the Giants took advantage of it. There are some questionable play calls, too, on Washington's defense. This is one of them where I was like, what the hell are you doing? Yeah, it's a good point. They're playing to the sticks, I guess, running cover zero. Like, but you're right. It's so easy to just run a clear out and then have somebody run underneath that. Yeah, it's you know, you get aggressive and you get burnt sometimes. The quarterback reads it. That's exactly what happened there. This was the throw I was talking about. I guess it was fourth quarter, whereas this is just James fully trusting neighbors to win his route, which I fucking love. Yeah, exactly. Because you know he's going to win it. And then look again, this is a far hash. And where's this where's this where's this cornerback's leverage inside leverage to the inside. So what is that quarterback thinking? Oh, I can't allow Malik neighbors to win at the inside. I'm like neighbors, I can't, but I'm a neighbor. And he wins to the inside. And he wins to the inside, and the ball is delivered well. And again, like this, this safety is going to be gaining a ton of depth because you have this deep route by, by Darnell Mooney, and that's going to open up this dig route. And then Isaiah likely takes away the other defender. So that cornerback, I think it's a Meek Robertson, or no, no, no, 24, but that cornerback 24 cannot allow him to the inside. And he gets inside so easily. And that's the funny thing to me, like I think a lot of fans will view this, or people, let's say, not fan, whoever, will view this as a very simple play. But if it was so simple, why would the Giants not able to make these far hash rips for seven straight years? It's clearly not that simple. And I don't see a lot of the, see a lot of bad quarterback play around the NFL. So I just think what he's doing has been very, very underrated. Yeah, no, 100% here. Like this is another, like Jamis, this player bales off the line of scrimmage right at the snap. Jamis sees it. And then he, like, because again, this could, this would have been like another like man beater possibly, where Theo Johnson's route would have picked this player, right? And sorry, my computer is acting up right now. You would have picked this player and then you would have had Malik neighbors underneath. But Jamis diagnoses right at the snap. Dan, at 45, Caleb Onchason is dropping off and being like a curl flat defender. So he fires to Isaiah Likely, no, or I mean, not Isaiah Likely, Theo Johnson, knowing that nobody is there to cover Theo Johnson. That's that's Jamis Winston recognizing right at the snap, the coverage and diagnosing it. And that's why Theo was late to see it. Theo turns his head late, right? And then he's like, oh shit, the football. And he actually catches it, which is insane, cause it's Theo Johnson. But like that all happens because pre-snap, you want neighbor, you want this to be like a man coverage. Look where my league neighbor is going to win to the inside and then you can get them underneath and blah, blah, blah. But that's not what happens right at the snap. Jamis diagnoses the attacks is decisive. Like that's what I want to see from Jamis Winston. It's not synonymous with his skill set either. That's a great point. And I feel like when he's doing, when these things types of things are happening, when he's working from the shotgun to become a leader. It's hard to argue against, man. Again, that's another 12-personel play of man. He has his own beaters. Great breakdown by you. Thanks, buddy. Here's to the first-in-ten touchdown to... Just let my neighbors make a play. Trust him. That's what he does. This is a cool thing about Jamis' experiences. No matter what, we know he trusts neighbors. Neighbors are going to have so much fun with this quarterback, dude. Like the guy got him 20 targets in this game. Look at Cam Scadaboo, by the way, in pass protection. Another cover-zero look. Cam Scadaboo takes this safety and just throws it around. Just pancakes him. Bro, he literally is a little... You have the end-zone view of this. I tweeted the end-zone view. It might be different from yours, but that's Malik Neighbors winning against Mike Sandwerstil. No safety help. It's quickly diagnosed. They were running a lot of cover-zero at this point, and Jamis just knows exactly where he's going with the football, and the protection holds up. Kudos to the protection. But yeah, this is the end-zone view of my angle of... I have the other one, which I liked even better, but let's see if I can find it. You're all 22 this week is better than mine when it comes to... I got better all 22 than you this week for sure. Last week, yours was better. Yeah, here's one of those plays I was referring to before, right? Far hash, right? Look at how far he is, and this is a plus split. He's outside the numbers, Jamis Winston. So this player is gonna assume inside leverage, give the free release. Jamis Winston needs to put a perfect throw on this. The safety is kind of baiting it to you. You're like, hey, we're gonna give them space, but we're gonna have a safety there, so you need to execute with perfect timing if you want to deliver this football. And this ball is well delivered, and it's catchable. It's a good play by the cornerback. Maybe it's a little late, but Jamis Winston's like, screw it. I'm not gonna allow you to get cute with how you want to manipulate space, Dan Quinn. F you. I know you used to do that at the previous Giants teams. We're not doing it here. That's a great, great encapsulation of what we were discussing before. Yeah, man. No, this play is probably encapsulates the best. I think there were like three or four instances of this. I love how Jamis is willing to do that too as a quarterback. He's like, F you, dude. Don't give me that much space. I'll just fire the ball out there and we'll see what happens. Maybe neighbors will make a play on the ball. And he didn't this time, but he did basically every other time. Yeah, exactly. Here's the third and two 19-yard run. Another amazing play call here from MattNagy. I did like this play call a lot, man, because you motion likely, right? So you already have them looking at Isaiah likely. It's just eye candy. And then it's just a little crack toss pitch. Get Marcus Bowe on the run. And Kam Skadewit, this is an excellent job by him, right? Blocking. And you also have the defense just not really being... They don't have a second level of the defense. They had everybody mugged up on the line of scrimmage. It was the perfect play call against that. Yeah, no. They were in a lighter personnel package. Stretch them out and beat them side line to side line. And that was just a great counter. We always talk about the chess match. That was MattNagy winning the chess match. This is one of the best throws. This is the throw of the game. This is the one I was talking about. This is one of the best throws in the last 10 years of Giants football. And again, dude, the tension on the league neighbors. I just can't help but laugh because you have trail tech inside leverage from Mike Sanderson still. And then you have a safety who's also over the top. And then you have this safety right here who is like, yeah, I'm not gonna let him break over the middle of the field. James is like, fuck it. They're taking away like all three levels of how he could win this route. And he still wins. Dan, it's just an insane throw by James Winston. Yeah. It's like every coach would probably tell you not to tempt that throw. Yes. Because of all the things you said about the trail technique, the inside leverage, this is just like he doesn't listen to any of that. He just trusts it. And he throws this ball with such good anticipation, velocity, trajectory, and pace that it doesn't matter. Like when you execute at this level as a quarterback, none of it matters. None of the coverage matter. None of it. Like we saw this throughout the careers of the best quarterbacks. He's not one of them. I know he had a bad first half. He's mixed tons of mistakes. I get it. He's slow. But like there are moments like this from Jamus where this is as as elite of a play, an individual play from a quarterback as you'll find on any tape from any quarterback across the board in the NFL from week five. 100%. And then look at the top of the screen, you have that same leverage that we were talking about all game, the inside leverage against Malachi Fields. This is man coverage, right? Man coverage. You have a rat in the hole there. You have a robber. And Jamus Winston still throws over the robber, over the trail technique, and between the deep middle of the field, closed safety who's tasked to clamp down on the league neighbors. Insane individual effort by neighbors too, because this is what happens when you have an elite wide receiver, right? When you have someone like this, this is Justin Jefferson, this is Jamar Chase type of stuff, and that's who the league neighbors is. He is in that echelon of wide receivers. And no, we have not seen it consistently borne out throughout his career because he's been plagued by injuries. But he has that talent where he can win one on one. He's like, oh, we're in man coverage. I can beat my guy in man coverage. Oh, you have zone coverages that are looking at me. I can still get open if the quarterback is willing to throw me the football. You always have a chance when you have a wide receiver like the league neighbors. You're 100% right. I think the more important part of that is that right now, James Winston recognizes that. That's the important thing to me because we've had Beckham, we've had neighbors, we've had guys like this. At all times, the quarterback hasn't done a great job of recognizing that, in my opinion. Again, sorry to draw back on it, but it is what it is. I'm talking about Giants football. That's how you do things. Nobody seems to care when I draw back references to the other position groups. But now we have a quarterback who recognizes it, trusts it, and is willing to throw it to neighbors a lot. And it spots where you wouldn't expect him to. Like that one. And like the field side, the far hash one we went over earlier where they were giving all that space to the field side. That was a fun breakdown. Dan, I say we transition a little bit to our offensive line and talk about it. They're pass protecting pretty well. The Giants are helping them out, running back, all that. Which is what I expect. Especially when you have guys consistently winning their one-on-one matchups, like Isaiah Likely and Malik Neighbors. You don't need as many routes out there if you want to keep a tight end into Chip and he could just be a dump off option for Jameis Winston. But early on in the game, the run blocking has been a problem and kudos to Dan Quinn too because there were just a lot of run blitzes that seemed to know what the Giants were doing. A lot of Sonny Styles penetrating, a lot of Frankie Louvoo penetrating Pauls and just blowing up and forcing one-on-one matchups where the Giants would lose at the point of attack. Whether that be Francis Malionneau, who I felt like probably had his worst game. I would like to get your opinion on that. Last week was pretty bad. This week was pretty freaking bad. And he had some highlight blocks and I put them on Twitter. I'm like, hey, look at this block. But I come on here and I'm like, hey, to be honest, I felt like he lost a lot of matchups. One on one game specifically. Yeah, in the run game specifically. Hudson I felt like was fine. I think he is an upgrade over JMS personally. He's not the body mover that you might want. He is a slight upgrade, I'd call him, yeah. He's not the body mover that you want. I just think he's dialed in technically sound. That's fair. And he plays low, dude. I feel like his hips are always low and he's always driving his feet into contact. I don't see him out of position all that much. It's like play strength is maybe my biggest gripe with Brian Hudson, which is a similar gripe that I have with JMS. But overall, I came away like I'll give you my own heralded players, Brian Hudson. I feel like he was fine in this game. Right. Aaron Stinney saw five snaps in the big offensive line package. Wasn't all that successful. Andrew Thomas definitely playing through a groin injury, it seems like, because he is not the same AT. No, he is not the same. He's losing a lot. Now, he were used to it. Exactly. Relative to his skill set. He's still Andrew Thomas. He still has plenty of one-on-one wins and his tape is still much better than I say any offensive lineman that we've seen in quite a while. But what we know and who we know Andrew Thomas is, and then you see his tape, you see him losing to certain guys. And I'm just like, he's got to be being bothered. Aluminor looked fine when he was in there. And then I felt like Bo looked. I liked what I saw from Bo. Yeah. I'm going to do a piece on Big Blue View on Marcus Bo, like I did with Brian Hudson. And he lost it. I think he gave up two pressures and he lost around the edge a few times. But overall, like think about the context. He stepped in, I think on a third and eight, third and eight play, right away. What did the commanders do? They ran a twist right at him, picked up, boom, instantly. And I think the next play was the fourth and four play to Tyrone Tracy Jr. That was to his side where he leaked out. So he came into a game. I think what impressed me the most with Bo and I'm curious to get your take, guys, the things that bothered him last year, like the times where people tried to bull rush him, I thought he should good anchor in this game. And I think he did a good job. Like all these offensive linemen that the Giants have, this farm of offensive linemen, including Hudson, like these young guys, they all have fluid hips, which is something I appreciate. They're all flexible and they have bend in their lower half, meaning they can re-anchor themselves and re-sink their hips, and they can dip down at the waist and then unlock their power through the ground into the point of contact. They all have that trait. And like, Evan Neil didn't have that. Evan Neil couldn't do that, right? Physically, I don't think he could have done that from his example, yeah. Exactly, so I appreciate that about JC. Davis, I appreciate that about Marcus Bowe, about Brian Hudson. But Bowe, look, the Giants were down big in this game. They had three touchdown drives. Marcus Bowe was their starting right tackle, and he was being schemed against. Not like a cun, but they were setting blitzes and twists in his direction to try to manipulate him, and he held up. So I got to give a lot of credit to Marcus, but I felt like he comported himself very well in a tough situation on the road. And I thought the offensive line actually performed even better in pass protection than when you consider the context, which is they're in full comeback mode, the teams are keying off, they're not respecting the run at all, and you still have to pass protect. I've seen so many countless Giants games ruined in my lifetime in those spots, and there was no ruining really. James had plenty of time, I felt like. So we'll get to the grades later, but I had pass protection was high for me. Now, as far as the run game, do you want to say something before I get to the run? I do, just because Winston Wilson makes an excellent point in the chat, and it's something we need to acknowledge, because this is two straight games of pretty, pretty bad. Oh, interesting. I think it's a good point by John Michael Schmitz, might have been a stabilizing factor for CC, whereas Brian Hudson is another young player, and maybe it's putting more of a burden on CC. I think that's something we must acknowledge, at least going forward. If that is the case, and the Giants identify that, that's where you might see JMS get the job back, because I don't think the difference between Brian Hudson and JMS is a vast difference. I don't think it's a wide difference, but I do believe from what I've seen, Brian Hudson is offering a little bit more, but there are other parts of playing center that I can't opine on, or I don't know about because I'm not there. Maybe this is one about CeCe. The reason we drafted him in the first place, it's 60 overall or the we did. He's so smart. He's a smart guy. But no, but maybe that is a good point. I don't know. That's not something I can opine on. I really appreciate the point here, Winston Wilson, but I don't know enough offensive line player, offensive line coaching to know if that's the case. But if that is true, I'd rather almost, to me, I'd almost rather sacrifice losing a little bit, going from Hudson to JMS to maximize CC if that's the case. That's something the coaching staff will have to discuss and figure out. But I think you pretty much nailed it on Hudson. That's what I see too. He plays lower. He's more technically sound. I just don't think he's moving anybody at the point of attack. I see personally over the last two weeks, I've seen him make mistakes in the past game. That's not to say JMS didn't either, by the way. So I think they're pretty similar options moving forward. And my thoughts on, so I talked about the past blocking, my thoughts on the run blocking Nick and the offensive line, the run game in general. I think the problem we have is we just like don't get any pop on contact and we don't move the line of scrimmage at all. So there are times where I feel like technically the Giants offensive line is doing what they're supposed to do on a play. But even on those plays, the line of scrimmage isn't reset at all. It's still just like right there and nobody's really moving backwards. When I watch some of these teams that are run blocking well and running the football well, they're moving bodies backwards and creating maybe that little bit of space for the running back to plant and cut up. Instead of the running back having to kind of make his decisions from a standpoint of like no momentum moving forward, the running back will have a little bit of momentum to kind of then see the whole or at least just move forward then fire into where he wants to go with it. So I'll start by saying that I don't think they're technically that bad in the run game from a block standpoint, but they just don't have guys to move people. And then I felt like to be honest in this game, I thought that the running backs had a lot of misses from a vision standpoint. And I wrote a lot of those down, like I didn't think that they, the running back saw it well. There were a few times like, sir, sure, there were a few times where like one block was missed by Maui Noah and at least or Maui Noah, I think is how you're supposed to say it, not a Noah. Maui Noah on at least two occasions where I'm like, if that block was just made, I think there's something there. But there were also a few times where I felt like there were cutback lanes that Scadaboo didn't hit, that Najee didn't hit, and less so Tracy because he didn't really have those opportunities. That I feel like from a vision standpoint, the running back led their offensive line down too. So I would say most of the issue is just we don't move anybody off the line of scrimmage, but there are also issues with the running backs too, clear, clearly here. I also just think it's also good scheming and game planning by Washington. Because a lot of those, some of those Najee runs, there wasn't really a lot, there wasn't really space for him to run, and Scadaboo, but like, I think the first Najee run once he got in there, they were like, oh, it's under center. They're probably going to get the football for Najee. And Sonny Stiles blitzed and hit Hudson. And then that freed up Kinlaw. And like they just they had a lot of good run blitzes to defend against what the Giants want to do, which was dictate the line of scrimmage and run the football. So that's something the Giants need to try to work around. But overall, I agree with you. I just don't the Giants don't have a lot of they don't have blockers who really like move bodies. Right. That's not something they can have the double team. They don't want duo too much. It doesn't seem like there are other teams that run it a lot more than the Giants. When they can form those double teams, I feel like they do a solid enough job. And then they climb to the second level. I think the first the first play might have been duo. I don't have it in front of me. And they got five yards, right? They were like, oh, okay. Five yard gain against Washington on the road. That's solid. But overall, man, it's just like Runyon, whoever's playing center. None of these guys are like ass kickers as run blockers. Illuminaur, like I think Thomas can be, but Thomas is playing injured and then CC is, but CC is framing his blocks a little bit incorrectly and seems to have a lot of us played at the moment. Yeah, I think you're right. And is there a solution for the run game? Like, do you find it's because I'll ask you this, Nick, like with where we're at with the run game, I think back and I think somebody made a great point in the comments, Danger Zone, said GregRoman had awful offensive line play with the Chargers, which he did because there were a lot of injuries and there were a lot of random dudes coming in last year. And they still kind of did get the run game going. I remember like they had some interesting plays. Vidal made the most of it and looked pretty effective. And I think the numbers bear it out from a metric standpoint. They were pretty effective as a run game. What's holding us back? I mean, if that's the case, like if Roman was able to design a run game that worked in Los Angeles as recently as last season with, I'd say, worse offensive line talent than the current healthy group of the Giants because they were all injured. They didn't have Slater. They didn't have all, didn't have anybody, really. Why are we unable to do that? Is that make it more on the running backs or is that just because Herbert's there and he's holding the edge line, you know, the edge defender? What do you think it is? And is there any hope moving forward for this run game? I mean, is there any hope? I'm sure there are some hope. I mean, if the Giants continue, continually throw for 350 and 3, I think teams are going to have to adjust a little bit more. It may not be as aggressive with their run blitzes. And I just think Giants, from a communication standpoint up front, they can execute better, too. I think there's a little bit of that. I don't think we've seen the potential of CeCe Malanoa really yet. And I still think he's had a lot of highlight plays. I don't think he's playing up to what he could be even as a rookie. Andrew Thomas, we're not getting the best play from. I think you're going to lose a little bit with Bowe as a run blocker. I don't know how long Illuminaur is going to be out, but Illuminaur, yeah, he's not somebody who moves dudes all the time, but he's a good enough run. But he's a good offensive line. I feel like Jermaine Illuminaur was one of the best signings that Joe Shane has made, especially when he got him for like six or seven million, whatever the hell it was a year at that time when they signed him, because he's been steady Eddie for the Giants and it sucks that he's dealing with a calf injury at the moment. But I'm taking a week by week, different game plans. I guess I didn't mean to put you on this, but I guess we'd have to look back and we don't have time to do this at the Chargers tape last year and see what they did in the run game to free up Vidal. But it is interesting that they were able to generate in the run game last year and were not with the same coach. Chargers were interesting too just in general though. They had Aranda Gatson come out of nowhere last year and just become this phenom at tight end for them. He was the offensive coordinator too, Roman, right? He was just our run game designer, which I think he has a massive role with MattNagy. But yeah, that would take time to really figure out. I do like the use of Tyrone Tracy Jr. though, man. I appreciate getting him back on the field. I think they need that type of explosiveness. He looked fine, he did good in past protection. So I'm just, I am curious on what the hell's gonna happen with this running back room moving forward. I think the Singletary call that we had yesterday is one that we should be paying attention for and hopefully he gets his opportunity. I think he will, but I'm not sold on that. I think the one thing I am sold on is Tracy's role will continue to grow because he's kind of gotten himself out of the dog house. We saw grow a little bit last week and then even more this week. That will just continue to grow. And I still think Scadaboo is a good player in overtime. He had bursts of 9, 11. He looked good to me in overtime. And those runs, by the way, came out of shotgun. So it's not like if we go to shotgun and we spread them out and this is our new identity, we can't run the ball. Actually, it's quite frankly, the opposite in this past game. Our two biggest runs came out of shotgun when we were spread out. So just keep that in mind. We have seen a pony package, too, like not Patrick Ricard with JJ McCarthy in there. We saw Tyrone Tracy Jr. and Najee Harris, I think it was. What the hell is Kim's Gattaboo? You know, you guys have, you know, but the JJ McCarthy experiment, like I did not like that. No, we can't do that again, unless he's going to throw. I understand what they're trying to do. I don't like that. It removed the rhythm. I want to say that. It killed a drive, literally. We were actually moving, after the third and 13 likely conversion, like we got out of a third and 13 hole, and then we just killed our drive by doing that. And I'm pretty sure when, when Jamis came back on the field, they took a delay of game penalty. Right. It's like, yeah, blame Jamis. Like, yeah, Jamis was running from the sideline, trying to collect himself, because he wanted to bring out this stupid ass package that didn't have him come close to work. And like the one, the third down, where they like, that was so bad. I went back and rewatched that three times on tape, Nick. And I'm like, there was nothing that was going to work here. If he had handed the ball off, and they tried to run outside, it was done. The defense was just totally aware that, like, McCarthy wasn't going to vertically throw the ball on that play. So it just, it's like, basically it was like running Wildcat, but with McCarthy. Yeah. Think how dumb that is to run Wildcat, but with a quarterback. Yeah. And he's this guy, this isn't Taysom Hill. You know, that's what I mean. It was like a Wildcat with a regular quarterback. Like, he didn't even make the wrong read on that one play. No, it was the right read and it doesn't matter because he's 190 pounds and not a running back. And Frankie Louvoo literally just picked him up and dropped him. And I was like, yeah, Frankie Louvoo's a... He's 190 and he's not a running back at all. He's nowhere close to a running back. Longtime listeners know this is a Frankie Louvoo podcast. Yeah, you're a big Frankie Louvoo guy. Big Frankie Louvoo guy. Yeah, he's one of my tape guys, like my Foley Fatukasi. There's so many guys throughout the history of this podcast. He's like niche players where it's just like, yeah, Nick, like Chris Mannertz was one way before he was a giant. I was big Chris Mannertz guy. Now he's a giant. I'm just over the moon. Yeah, I love it. I absolutely do. All right, Nick, anything else offensively before we get to some superlatives? Anything else do we have here? I have a shit ton of notes, but I think that we hit on everything that I wanted to touch on. But yeah, let's get into the superlatives. All right, superlatives for this game. Let me get mine up here real quick. Yeah, I'm a heralded player. For me, it was Brian Hudson, by the way. I went with Marcus Bow for stepping into the game off the bench cold, and I thought he held his own. Absolutely. That's a great call. Best throw. Best throw was the obvious one. It was the 440 over time, first and 10, the middle of the field, the neighbors, the one we broke down. It was insane. But honestly, dude, the throw to likely in the end zone might be simpler because it's like traveled 10 yards, maybe the ball. It may be more difficult. Yeah, dude, it's this, but like it was crazy. Like that was another, like James Winston, you know, like, dude, I'm not gonna lie, through halftime last, I was like, dude, why aren't we gonna see, why aren't we gonna see JJ McCarthy? This is what we're getting from James. It started to get to that point in my mind where at least I was asking that question, like, is JJ ready? Does he know the playbook enough? Is that where we want to go? Is that the smart thing? And then James Winston did James Winston stuff. And this is bottom time. And you know, I gotta think that we're gonna see JJ McCarthy at some point this season. And I don't think James is gonna be able to consistently throw 350 for 3 or 300 for 3. But he has this in his wheelhouse. And whenever whenever I see James do James shit, I got to reflect back on this and be like, James Winston can easily throw for 300 yards in a quarter. You know, like, that's something. And not only do that, but by by doing so doing the things we just went over, like throw the far hash to the field side, throw against, see the leverage that's disrespectful and actually take advantage of it. I'll make this call right now because I think you're right. Unfortunately, at some point, we will get impatient. The fans will get impatient. The coaches will get impatient and they'll go to McCarthy. I can I'm going to predict right now that when they do go to McCarthy, we are going to be so much more frustrated as a fan base watching the offense. Neighbors is going to be wildly frustrated as a wide receiver. The offense is going to get boring, more predictable, more under center. And it's going to be like a poor man's version of what they tried to do with Dart. And it's going to be overall fewer points. We're going to score fewer points. We have 63 points over the last two weeks with James Windsor. We're going to score fewer points. We're going to have more three in outs. We're going to have more punts when that happens. So to me, it's not even at this point even up for debate. I'm not even considering it. I would need two horrific games from James to even consider it because I know what's behind that door. It's not the mystery box people think it will be. Sure, the run game will be better. I respect that big motion. It's true. Great. The run game is better. We're putting up 63 points in two games with six offensive touchdowns. Do you want to go back to that 2022 grind of offense style? Do you want to go back to that? Because if you do, you better hope our defense is ready to make big plays and turnovers. Because that grind out style in 2022 ain't sustainable. It barely got us to the playoffs and it only want us a game against a pathetic Minnesota Vikings events that fired their coordinator days later for running some of the worst fucking scheme you'll ever see in the NFL history. Yeah. Best overall player. I just had to rant that out because I don't want to go back to that offense so fast. I don't want to go back to boring offense. I like throwing the ball vertically. Best player overall for me was Jameis Winston. Straight up. Best player overall. Same, same. Jameis Winston. Malik and I likely honorable mentions, of course. Yes, yes. Why are we expected to see more from? I went with Kam Skatibou. I've given Kam Skatibou's flowers at times on the show more likely last season and going into this season. I think Skatibou's been a worse player this year. I think the fumble is just unacceptably bad for where the Giants were at in that game and where they're at as a team. Chance to go to four and one with a two-game lead. Didn't do enough outside of that. Like I mentioned earlier, I have a few things in my notes. Tracy had one play. I want to correct what I said earlier. There was a play from, I believe it was, it was a second and 10. I don't remember when it was, where they pulled Maui Noah, I should say. Tracy cut back inside and it was like a two-yard game to go to third and eight. If he cuts outside behind Maui Noah, I think it's a huge gain. I want to correct that. It wasn't just Nagy and Skadewu, but overall I felt like the vision was pretty poor for all three running backs, including Skadewu. I would say Nagy's seven-yard rush, which was his only rush that was good. That was a great read by him. The cut back. It was a good read by him. It was a really good read by him. That was the one time when Washington's defense was like, that they just commit and they crashed down the line of scrimmage and it was just grass. But again, if that was Tyrone Tracy Jr. or Kim Skadewu, probably more than a seven-yard gain because the lateral quickness on a player like Nagy Harris is not great. And it's the worst in that room. For me, player I expect to see more from was Cece Malionov. Pass blocking. Your next High Five moment awaits. No purchase necessary. Voidware prohibited by law must be 21 years or older. Terms and conditions apply. High Five Casino. And let me just respond to this real quick. Someone said, remember, we also scored 12 with Jameis. Yeah, in a monsoon, windy, raining conditions where we had a 12-0 lead and didn't try to throw the ball. That's not an acceptable defense against that right now for me. I just want to, the context is important. Now, sorry, offensive line breakdown. It just bothered me. I'm giving a, for the past blocking, I'm going 8.3 for me, given the conditions, given the fact that we were playing from behind and we had to throw in. Everyone knew we would be throwing the ball. Yeah, I have a 7-5, but it makes me want to go higher. So it was pretty good. Yeah, for those conditions. Run blocking, 1-9. I just hate this run blocking, bro. Yeah, I said 2-4, but I could go lower, too. I don't know how to fix it either, by the way. I'm not as, I don't know what we do there, but we'll see what happens. Yeah, man. All right. This was a fun podcast. We've got super chats, too, actually, for the Supes. Let's hit some Supes. I'll be grouping in the super chats and the superlatives. Cy, thank you so much. Thank God, a FO as competent as the Ravens chose, washed Andrews over, likely, front office. Also looks like Leake is trusting his legs more. Each catch, he's going to house a game. Yes, game winning, long touchdown soon. Fingers crossed. Grease. Cy, JCNYC. Thank you, said Bradshaw. And Jacobs weren't number one running backs. This offensive line needs to block better. We've got good enough backs. Scat, if coachable, will be better. Yeah, I mean, I do tend to agree that the offensive line needs to block a little bit better. I also think the running backs aren't one backs. I think Jacobs could have been a one back personally. And Bradshaw was an excellent running back too at that time. They were great. I mean, they are a great point, though, as far as like, you don't need a one back if you have a great blocking offensive line. 100%. Yeah. I mean, you couldn't like, I mean, Kyle Shanahan's offense. Yeah, the number one rushing team by far in the NFL is the Bears and they have Swift and Menungai. It's so funny that Kyle Shanahan's offenses, like they would take like Kevin Coleman and all these like they were good backs too. Don't get me wrong. But they would take like these nondescript backs and they would turn them into like pro bowlers. And then like, he's like, you know what? I'm just going to go get Christian McCaffrey. Like what? What? You're allowed to do that. It is just crazy, crazy weapon that they have there. Jason Benjamin, thank you, bud. As always said, can only imagine what Washington fans are going. Yeah, dude. Washington fans. That's that's I think I would imagine that was us podcast. We would have had the best Dan rant in the world. Oh, I couldn't even I probably have a heart attack on it. And look, there's a lot of discourse on there. There's a lot of discourse about it right now. But like, I can't help but just look at Jane Daniels and be like, like, sure, like, you got to know what's going on. It's going to fall on the coach. Sure. But like, that's like your your quarterback Tom Brady would never do that. For example, now that was like Eli Manning would never have that happen. Now, he flat out just didn't know the situation on the court. And it's not just him, dude. Like Traylon Burks was down the field, like talking to Greg Newsome after the play and shit like any idea what was going on. The only players who did was Sam Cosme and the tackle who plays next door. Those were the only two guys who were like, oh, what the fuck? You know, like everybody else was like, everyone else was like, oh, I guess we're going to kick the field goal and go home. I wonder what I'm going to eat after the game. I'm like, dude, what are they doing? I was like, oh my God. And I see Kay Banks like, Kay Banks and Tremaine Evans just run off the field like they just want to shoot balls. Improbable, improbable win. Or I've tied, see, not even a win. Jason, thank you. Said, look at Marcus Bowe shutting down. Yeah, Bowe looked good. You could probably talk about the film review, but yeah, Bowe was really good stepping in. Yeah, man, absolutely. Ox, thank you so much. I tried to put some pause golf sayings in super, but wouldn't let me. Hilarious, golf Saturday going to the game Sunday. I'm hyped. These breakdowns are nice. Where are you playing, Deuce? Where are you playing Saturday? It's actually going to be pretty bad golf weather Saturday. It's going to be playable, but it's going to be really cold. I think it's 48 degrees. I'll be out there as well. Throw up this Zavada miss real quick. This was the open time. Are we talking about the draw? We can talk about the draw. This is when you try to hit the draw, but it's a quick snap hook. This is the golfers, the kicking version of a snap hook. You see that thing snap hook right off his foot. Watch it again. This is the dreaded snap hook. Every golfer who hits with the draw off the tee knows about the snap hook. There it is. Immediately snaps and just goes wild. You could see the fans knew that was going to miss miles before it got there. Just a really poor kick, unfortunately, for Zavada here. It seems like he knew it right off the kick too, man. Yeah, he snapped it. You know it. When you hit a drive that's a snap hook, you know it immediately. And then you see it snap its way out of bounds. And now you're dropping for three. You're only like 160 yards. It dropped in only 160 yards. It's just miserable. I just hope it doesn't get in his head, man. Look, you're a good kicker. Remember, you're a good kicker, Dominic Zavada. Do not allow this little trial to keep him from beating down. And I'll say this, I watched all his other kicks, even the other two misses. I felt like they were all better strikes than this one. This was just a bad strike. Yeah, I agree. That's all of our supers though. All right. Thank you so much for tuning in. Please hit the like button. Please leave comments before, during and after the show. Support what I felt like was a very strong show by us today, breaking down the tape, talking a lot of NFL concepts and Xs and Os that I think you won't find anywhere else. So thank you so much. Have a great rest of your night and we'll talk to you soon.